Nov. 14, 2022

Harsh but Truthful

Harsh but Truthful

We're talking about telling it like it is, not being worried about looking ugly, and not allowing ourselves to get so offended. Everyone goes through moments where they get offended in a friendship. But have you noticed that in our current culture, as soon as someone gets offended, it's the end of the friendship?Relationships have become disposable because it's so easy to just avoid a person or a certain problem forever, and never want to talk about it again. This takes us back to the saying “How you start something is how you end”. We can't end on a bad note and think that we can go into this other thing and start all over, with a clean slate. The same issues will inevitably come up again. So if we get offended by someone and we end that relationship because we never want to talk to this person again, whatever issue was a charge is going to happen again. That same issue in some other form is going to come up again.
Further discussion leads us to explore when being polite at all costs is ruining our humanity and our relationships/friendships. We explore the delicate balance of telling it like it is, perhaps appearing harsh, but needing to be truthful in order to be good friends. Sometimes being unafraid to look foolish or ugly can save our lives.

We're talking about telling it like it is, not being worried about looking ugly, and not allowing ourselves to get so offended. Everyone goes through moments where they get offended in a friendship. But have you noticed that in our current culture, as soon as someone gets offended, it's the end of the friendship?

Relationships have become disposable because it's so easy to just avoid a person or a certain problem forever, and never want to talk about it again. This takes us back to the saying “How you start something is how you end”. We can't end on a bad note and think that we can go into this other thing and start all over, with a clean slate. The same issues will inevitably come up again. So if we get offended by someone and we end that relationship because we never want to talk to this person again, whatever issue was a charge is going to happen again. That same issue in some other form is going to come up again.

Further discussion leads us to explore when being polite at all costs is ruining our humanity and our relationships/friendships. We explore the delicate balance of telling it like it is, perhaps appearing harsh, but needing to be truthful in order to be good friends. Sometimes being unafraid to look foolish or ugly can save our lives.





[00:00:01] FAWN: everybody. Hello. Welcome. I told you, what did I tell you about the Hello .

[00:00:07] MATT: Hello everyone.

[00:00:08] FAWN: Thank you. Hello. Love you. Love is winning.

[00:00:15] FAWN: oh dear. This week, today we're talking about giving it to you straight, telling it like it is, right? So I'll tell you how it is, honest. I have to get things off my chest. This week was hard, This week was hard. Uh, Allegra had a meltdown. I'm like, Okay, let's change the perspective. The meltdown happened because of math, which, you know, when I started homeschooling, I started to really love math because, My perspective changed and I got emotional about it.

[00:00:46] FAWN: Like I really wanted to understand this thing that always gave me trouble in school. And then, because I could start from the very beginning, like preschool age up until now, we're like, you know, the kids are like, like big

[00:01:03] MATT: seventh, ninth, 10th, seventh, eighth, ninth, 10th. God, I missed eight.

[00:01:08] FAWN: Anyways. But you know, they're like doing like pre-calculus, calculus kind of stuff.

[00:01:15] FAWN: It's,

[00:01:15] MATT: the math is getting more intense

[00:01:16] FAWN: for sure. So, um, alright. So. You know, even though I, I got into a state where I was like, Wow, I get math now. , it's really amazing. I love it. I am still frustrated by it. I still don't understand it, but when I'm able to understand, because now I'm tired with all my years on being on the planet so far dealing with math, I'm like, Okay, fine, fine.

[00:01:45] FAWN: I give up. I give in. I'll just memorize what you're telling me to memorize because as a kid I'm like, How dare you tell me to memorize this bizarre thing? Tell me how you got there. Who discovered this? Why are you making me memorize it and not, you know, ask any questions, like, just memorize this and just do it.

[00:02:04] FAWN: No, thank you, sir. Do you know what I'm saying? It made me mad. Cause I'm a, I'm a defiant kind of person. Right. And I, I had don't tell

[00:02:11] MATT: me what to do. Totally different mentality towards the whole thing, which was,

[00:02:14] FAWN: Well, you were taught by good teachers.

[00:02:16] MATT: Let's, let's memorize it and let's be as fast as we can and fast and safe as we can and call

[00:02:22] FAWN: it a day.

[00:02:23] FAWN: See, I just wanted to understand the philosophy of it. Right. Right. It's just, and no one taught me any of that. So, And no one cared about me. Do you know what I'm saying? And that's, Oh, you got this wrong. Oh, well, f. Oh my God, thank you to my 12th grade teacher, because I seriously needed to flunk. She gave me a D minus and I graduated high school.

[00:02:45] FAWN: But anyway, so since then I've become obsessed with math. I love it, and I really wanna learn trig, all of that. So I'm learning with the kids and thank God we have you Matt, because you actually, this is your jam math. So you're able to make sense of it. And when it, when I do the research before the kids learn it, you teach me.

[00:03:09] FAWN: I'm like, okay, no. Okay, I get it. Ooh. Now I remember from when I was a kid, Like I didn't think that, you know what I mean? I actually remember stuff.

[00:03:17] MATT: I feel you.

[00:03:18] FAWN: but anyway, long story short. Like Allegra had a meltdown. And even though I love math, I gotta tell you, M A T h, mental abuse to humans. That that, oh dear, that comes into my head like it is mental abuse to humans.

[00:03:33] FAWN: I hate it. You know? And then when we get it, I always whisper to Allegra's ear. I used to do it to L two. I'm like, Math is our bitch. And we started laughing . Oh dear. Like once we have a down right. So there was a meltdown. You were trying to teach her like an engineer and you know, we all know like, I don't know any of you out there who had like, Super smart parents.

[00:03:59] FAWN: Like Matt's, Matt's dad was, uh, rocket scientist. See, I don't think

[00:04:03] MATT: that's fair. Let's say very, what is it? Left brain, right brain that an super analytic parents, let's call it that. Let's not say super smart, cuz smart comes in all shapes and sizes and

[00:04:15] FAWN: colors. I say a rocket scientist trying to give you a math equation explanation.

[00:04:20] FAWN: They don't have the same vocabulary to say, Hey look, this is what's happening. You are the same way. Matt, when we met, I was trying to go digital with photography , and you were explaining things to me. I'm like, I have no idea what's coming outta your mouth. I have no idea what you're saying. Ex of JP. Ping and you would get so upset.

[00:04:40] FAWN: We got into a fight one day and I called Greg, who's this amazing graphic designer who is very tech savvy, who's straddling

[00:04:48] MATT: both sides of his brain. Right. The left

[00:04:50] FAWN: and the right. Exactly. So he spoke my language. Anyway, so I called Greg. And my nose was stuffy and he immediately said, . Cause I called him at work.

[00:04:59] FAWN: You're

[00:04:59] MATT: talking to that man about computers, aren't you? I know.

[00:05:02] FAWN: I mean, as soon as I called him, I called him at the office, like he worked at this huge ad agency. I'm like, Greg . He immediately said, Did you get into a computer fight with Matt? I'm like, Yes. He please explain. I, I barely had to tell him what was troubling me.

[00:05:21] FAWN: He's like, Oh. And he just explained in my, in my words, in like, in my language. I'm like, Oh i, I get it now. Thanks. And I'm like, Oh, thank you. Solved. Problem solved in like 10 seconds. Meanwhile, we were at it for like three hours fighting Anyway. You are teaching Allegra the way you do, which is great most of the time, but sometimes that engineering thing comes out in you.

[00:05:48] FAWN: So I'm like, Allegra, let's go on the yard. Let's come on. And she is inconsolable, she's crying, and now we're in the yard. And now she's screaming. I'm like, Oh man, the neighbor's gonna think. I'm like, Uh, an abuser.

[00:06:02] MATT: And here's where it gets twisted. She was like super pissed cuz the math wasn't coming out.

[00:06:08] MATT: Then we figured out the math and she was getting 'em all right. And I was like, See that? See that? You're getting it. You're getting it. You're, And then she, I still don't understand how that happened.

[00:06:19] FAWN: It's called frustration. Well,

[00:06:21] MATT: yeah, but we got over the, that level of frustration. We solved the problem

[00:06:24] FAWN: was on the bronze level.

[00:06:24] FAWN: She needed a break. And you're like, No, we need, we need to push through.

[00:06:27] MATT: We do.

[00:06:28] FAWN: I'm like, No,

[00:06:29] MATT: we did.

[00:06:29] FAWN: We needed a break. We needed sunshine and grass and grounding. But even that didn't work. Cause then she was yelling at me. Then she had a full on meltdown. The whole, I swear, miles away could hear her yelling and screaming.

[00:06:45] FAWN: And then she's like, Don't touch me. When I was trying to caress her head like, It's okay, you know? It was horrible. I kept my cool, I thought everything was okay. But I think the stress of that carried on to the next day. Cause the next day I had a meltdown. I. The stress of that, along with the stress of everything else in my life and the things that I have to take care of all came to a head when I was by myself going to get us groceries.

[00:07:12] FAWN: I was standing there trying to get a loaf of bread, find some lettuce, which I can never find. Why is lettuce is so expensive right now? It's terrible. Anyway, I started crying at the store. I'm like, Uh oh, . I haven't done this in a while. And then I'm like, Okay, whatever. I stopped crying, got the groceries, driving home, started crying again.

[00:07:36] FAWN: Some song came on. I'm like, I just cried. And I thought, Okay, I'm good now. But then I ended up having a meltdown later that day. It's been a hard week. And so anyway, all this to say, When we go through stuff and we're experiencing hardship or things happen, um, yes, we need kindness, but there are sometimes where you need to be told straight or you need to give it to someone straight.

[00:08:08] FAWN: Do you understand what I'm saying? Oh, ab,

[00:08:10] MATT: absolutely. I constant, not constantly, but um, yeah, I remember. I get all my news from England because that way I don't hear American football scores. Welcome to my world. Okay, fine. But I read an ad, a piece on an advice column, and God, this dude. And I was reading it and he sounded completely like, Oh yes, I'm very logical.

[00:08:33] MATT: I'm very rational and I'm very composed and I'm very everything. And he's talking about leaving his wife for his daughter's roommate because they bonded and connected and he's feeling that magical, special feeling about her. And I'm shaking my head the advice column lit his underwear on

[00:08:55] FAWN: fire . See, most people don't

[00:08:59] FAWN: do that

[00:09:00] MATT: saying, What are you even thinking?

[00:09:02] MATT: You are an I, I swear to God, she must have said, you insignificant little twit, . It was practically that bad, right? What are you thinking? In what world does this even remotely make

[00:09:16] MATT: sense?

[00:09:17] FAWN: We were talking

[00:09:18] FAWN: about how everyone goes through moments where they get offended in a friendship and how usually what's happening in our culture is as soon as someone gets offended, it's the end of the friendship.

[00:09:31] MATT: Right?

[00:09:31] FAWN: They just, it's disposable

[00:09:33] MATT: cause it's so easy to just avoid that problem for the rest of your life. Right. And ne you never need to talk about it. And

[00:09:39] FAWN: this also goes back to the other thing we were saying about how you start something is how you end. So you can't end on a bad note and think that you can go into this other thing and start all over again.

[00:09:51] FAWN: The same issues will come up, right? So if you get offended by someone and you end that relationship because you never wanna talk to this person again, now you know when it's going to happen again. That same issue in some other form is gonna come up again. Now this is different than dealing with someone that you realize, hey, this is their behavior their entire life, but they're not able to see how they're behaving, that it's borderline abusive or abusive. In that case, please get away from this person that is not your friend. That's not what I'm talking about here. What I'm talking about is we're human beings.

[00:10:32] FAWN: There's so many things happening. We're bound to get offended, and I'm just saying unless it's a, an abusive relationship, this doesn't count. In that case, if it's not an abusive relationship and you find yourself being offended, like check yourself and be strong enough to maybe perhaps allow for the person to check you, and I find that in the American culture in particular, especially a Caucasian culture, that that doesn't happen.

[00:11:07] FAWN: And it certainly doesn't happen. I've noticed because now we, you know, we have kids, but I've been noticing it since the kids were born from the instant that they were babies and we could take them to the playground. I have been watching and we have moved a lot, so from city to city, town to town, I've seen this how women treat their sons in partticular.

[00:11:33] FAWN: They'll treat their children this way, but I've just especially noticed it with, with how men are raised, how boys are raised, that when the boy acts up and has a tantrum and slaps the mother, the mother doesn't correct that child.

[00:11:49] MATT: I remember seeing that happen and the child had gotten to a point where they knew exactly how to best strike their mother.

[00:12:00] FAWN: And you knew, And by the way, I've seen this so many times. Frightening. It wasn't just one time we saw, I saw it a lot. Cause that was always at the playground. Mm-hmm. . Right? You were, you know, most of the time we were working. So you were there on the weekends where other guys were there, Like dads were there as well.

[00:12:16] FAWN: Mm-hmm. , but. If you're in there day in, day out, you see this kind of behavior, especially for someone like me who's on the outskirts of things because I'm not Caucasian. I was always left out of social groups, even at the playgrounds with other moms because they thought I was the maid or the nanny. I was never allowed in that group.

[00:12:36] FAWN: Right? So I noticed things. I'm like, Look at that. They do not correct their children. And I'm not saying physically correct them. I'm not saying beat them up and spank them. Not at all. What I'm saying is they're not even told, hey, or you know, stop the kid's hand and say, you get, you don't get to hit me.

[00:12:57] FAWN: You don't get to hit anyone. Right. NO! They don't use the word no because you know, I remember, remember when we had Elle like, they're like, Oh, never use the word no with your children. I'm like, REALLY?! . No ma'am. . And I fell into that too. I remember one day in the kitchen, Elle kept asking for things, and I never used the word no, but I, I, I kind of diverted.

[00:13:28] FAWN: No, but I didn't say no. However, how did I do it? But you commented on it. I'm like, oh my God, I am doing that. Like I'm not using the A word no, but I'm definitely letting her know, letting her understand that there's another way. Right. I was always course correcting immediately, even if it's out there in public, I had to course correct. If I saw another kid misbehave,

[00:13:51] FAWN: I immediately, immediately turned to Elle and Allegra. I said, You see that behavior right there, that's not gonna fly. Do you understand that? You don't ever act like that with me, with daddy or anyone else. You understand me? Oh my goodness. It's impossible. Dad. Mama. Yes, mama.

[00:14:06] MATT: It's impossible to watch like a family movie where the kids are doing anything that's, uh, below board,

[00:14:14] MATT: with my wife, without her saying, Oh, I'll, you see how, you see how these kids are acting on this movie? You don't do that. I,

[00:14:19] FAWN: I paused the movie right then and there. That's a teaching experience right there because we tend to ignore bad behavior in our culture, especially in the United States. Cause it's easy in the moment and it's constantly ignored for whatever reasons.

[00:14:32] FAWN: I don't care what the reason is. It's still ignored. I, granted we're busy, we gotta move on. But like, one of the things that I noticed, being a mom to little, little kids. . It's scary, especially being a, a non-white mother at a playground where I'm correcting my children and sometimes my voice is louder than it should be, but I'm still correcting them and saying, You know, that's not okay.

[00:14:59] FAWN: Right. Um, everyone stops and stares at you and it's quite scary cuz you're like, ugh, you're ostracized because you're not like you, you're not ignoring it and you're not being. Like them. Do you know what I'm saying? Well, you're not

[00:15:14] MATT: keeping quiet. You're not keeping to your place, whatever that

[00:15:17] FAWN: place is.

[00:15:17] FAWN: Yeah. Ugh. So, but that also translates, like I always say, friendship. The way things have progressed in our culture is because of how we were raised. How do you expect to have an understanding of what a true relationship is in friendship when from the very beginning you're taught that you're disposable or you, you have to be over here.

[00:15:41] FAWN: Oh, you're born, you're gonna go to daycare now. Oh, you're now this old. You're gonna go to the old folks home, that everyone has their own room inside of a house. You're just gonna go in your own room, your own car, your own this, your own that. Everything is so separate in our culture.

[00:16:02] FAWN: You know, I was kind, I was kind of raised with both, so I'm like, that's what I mean, It's our home. And no, you're not gonna get kicked out at 18. This is our home. It's our checking account. It is our life together. You're gonna go to college. It's our money. We're all gonna figure out how we're gonna make this happen, right?

[00:16:23] FAWN: , there is no, this is mine or this is my space and I'm gonna shut you out. Or do you know what I'm saying? Matt? You're just being quiet.

[00:16:33] MATT: Yeah. No abs. Here I go. Yeah, no, absolutely. .

[00:16:38] FAWN: Have you noticed? Every time I say something and Matt is quiet, I look at him. I'm like, Matt, what do you have to say? He goes, Oh, no, no, no, no.

[00:16:44] FAWN: Yeah, absolutely. He always says those. I do. I usually try to edit

[00:16:48] MATT: those things out. It gives my brain a, a chance to think.

[00:16:51] FAWN: Thank you. Well just think and say it.

[00:16:55] MATT: Okay. I'm sorry. Where were we now? I'm confused.

[00:16:58] FAWN: I don't know. I don't remember. I don't remember. Okay. So we're talking about giving it to you straight.

[00:17:06] FAWN: So what I'm, what I was trying to say is, everything stems from how we are raised. There's a problem with friendship. People forgot the art of friendship. That's because of how we're raised at home. We're not, we're not. Parents, but you know, we don't know how to be friendly. We don't know how to communicate with one another.

[00:17:27] FAWN: We don't know how to be in the same room. We don't know how to be still together. The, the pandemic was a great opportunity for everyone to just be still, That's true and be in the same room. But, you know, all I heard was like, um, at so many people think it was funny to send me these gifs these moms saying, Help me.

[00:17:49] FAWN: I'm stuck with my kids. You know? I'm like, Oh my God, I wanna be with my kids. I wanna be with you, Matt. If I didn't, I wouldn't be here. Right. I didn't have kids to just have like an accessory to in daycare and Right. Like it's a purse. Like, look at me. I got a kid. You know what I'm saying? I, before we had kids, I'm like, okay, it's not just cute baby.

[00:18:14] FAWN: It's gonna turn into an ugly teenager, maybe that's yelling at you . Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, absolutely. Um, and also I wanna hang out with these kids and I think in our culture we tend to shut everybody away.

[00:18:28] MATT: Right, Because I gotta take care of my

[00:18:30] FAWN: personal stuff. I don't know what it is, but you know, even the elderly, like everyone gets their own home.

[00:18:36] FAWN: Everyone get goes away at some point, right? Everyone gets put into some kind of daycare or something, or a home of some kind, right? And even if it's that, it's a, the home is some other place at age 18. Like go, you're out. Right? You're 18, you're on your own kid. What I'm trying to go for here is, That cooperative feeling like when you play a game, let's play together for one common goal.

[00:19:04] FAWN: When we're living together, let's live together. When we're eating, let's eat together, let's share our ideas. I can get offended. You can get offended. We're all living all these different experiences and friendships exactly the way we were living them growing up in our families.

[00:19:22] FAWN: I've been saying that throughout all the episodes, it goes also back to the same thing again. How you start is how you finish. How you finish is how you start. Absolutely. It's all related. So we were talking about, so obviously this fool who is married and has children and one of his kids has a friend, he's like, I think we have a connection.

[00:19:44] FAWN: And how this, Was she a therapist?

[00:19:46] MATT: What was she? It's like, Dear Abby,

[00:19:48] FAWN: so, but she lit him up. She lit him up. And I'm like, Well, that's rare because I've noticed. Please forgive me guys. It sounds terrible. But I've noticed in the Caucasian culture that it's very, everything is very polite. Certain cultures are very polite and you don't wanna, Well, it's very quiet.

[00:20:08] FAWN: Yeah. And that's another thing I think why people don't like me so much is I'm loud and when I'm happy, I'm like, woo loud. And when I'm angry, I'm loud . You know what I'm saying?

[00:20:19] MATT: Oh Lord.

[00:20:19] FAWN: I can also be quiet. But like I have all kinds of, frequencies and volumes

[00:20:24] MATT: right

[00:20:24] FAWN: to me. And that's not acceptable. In a lot of the cultures.

[00:20:28] FAWN: It has to be even keeled. It has to be very, um, What's the word for it? Like, what's

[00:20:38] MATT: the word for it? There's a lot of words. We go for unobtrusive and, and everybody has seen this, how when, when people come off the airplane, It used to be, and now I guess we we're not waiting the gates anymore, blah, blah, blah.

[00:20:53] MATT: Haven't done that for years and years and years. But you see it in the movies where like somebody comes off the airplane and they see this person they haven't seen in in years, and everybody yells and screams and, Oh my God, I can't believe you're here. Have you ever seen that in real life? I never have.

[00:21:11] MATT: And I remember tripping out

[00:21:13] FAWN: on that. Unless it's me that's in that

[00:21:16] MATT: Exactly. But it's always very dignified, like, Yes, let's go

[00:21:19] FAWN: get your bags. Have you noticed like even pain, and I'm killed of this too, actually, Like, I refuse to be loud when I'm in pain, right? Like when we went to the hospital and I was giving birth to Elle, I'm like, I'm not gonna yell.

[00:21:34] FAWN: They're like, No, you need to yell and like let it out. I'm like, Nope, there will be no grunting and no yelling. Because that really, um, is, um, scary to me, right? It's a trigger for me, and I'm sure being loud is triggering to other people. I get it. I. I forgot what I was gonna

[00:21:53] MATT: say. Well, I can, I can take off on this.

[00:21:56] MATT: Oh my Lord. Cuz yet we're all over the place today, folks.

[00:22:00] FAWN: No, I wanna hone it in though. Okay. Quickly say what you're gonna say. It's, it's not a quick thing to say. Just say it. It's too late. Go

[00:22:06] MATT: ahead. So I'm working at a big company and we went through the, um, active shooter. Training.

[00:22:15] MATT: Oh

[00:22:15] FAWN: my God. You did.

[00:22:16] MATT: We did.

[00:22:16] MATT: Because we have warehouses and we have offices and everybody needs to be aware of all this crap now. My two big takeaways, so there was a fire in a nightclub and a lot of people died and that's a really a shame. And one of the things they found out was there was a big old plate glass window that everybody was afraid to break and it would've saved so many people and people were afraid to go into the employee area to look for an exit.

[00:22:44] MATT: Everybody tried to crowd crowd out the front doors. That's why. Because, Because people were afraid. The other big takeaway, and, and this one's tragic and I'm sorry, I'm gonna do this to even myself cause I'm gonna get messed up cuz even just, I've talked about this with one or two people and I always get choked up.

[00:23:02] MATT: So I'm gonna go through this super fast and hopefully I won't. Um, but they talk about if you get shot, the difference between whether or not you live or die is in your own head, cuz you go into shock. If your thought is, I'm gonna get through this,

[00:23:23] MATT: If your thought is, I'm gonna get through this, you will. If your thought is, Why is this happening to me? What's going on? You're in trouble. You're in big. It's all mental. So you have to not be afraid. You have to be, not be afraid to be loud. You have to be not be afraid to share. You have to not be afraid to be stupid.

[00:23:44] MATT: You have to not be afraid. You

[00:23:46] FAWN: have to not be afraid of looking ugly. I think that's a problem with women. Why women are attacked. With, self defense that women are afraid to yell and say no, they're afraid to look ugly.

[00:24:01] FAWN: And so therefore you can't protect yourself.

[00:24:03] MATT: And also they're afraid to look stupid because this guy wasn't really following you to your car to do bad things to you. He was just going the

[00:24:10] FAWN: same way. See, this is what I'm talking about. You don't wanna offend someone, God forbid you offend someone that you don't even know.

[00:24:15] FAWN: That you don't even know. So you're gonna sacrifice your well-being, your, your life, your

[00:24:21] MATT: possible safety and everything else, because at the risk of offending

[00:24:24] FAWN: may look stupid or offending somebody. Yeah. And that goes for a friendship. So what I've noticed from the very beginning is, wow, like people don't give it to you straight.

[00:24:37] FAWN: They don't talk to you and everything is kind of superficial. So, alright. So one of our kids did something really stupid today, this morning, and we just spent hours talking about it and I. and I told her a story cuz I, she's like, Okay, I get it, I get it. I'm so sorry. I get it, I get it, I get it. I'm like, I don't know if you really do, because I wasn't raised properly, but I had a great teacher in the third grade, eight years old, Mrs.

[00:25:07] FAWN: Wilkinson. Right. She, one day had, um, didn't show up to class. So we were all sitting there waiting, and then the principal comes in and says, I'm sorry, Mrs. Wilkinson got into a traffic accident. She's not gonna be here today.

[00:25:21] MATT: Today. Well now, Now wait a second.

[00:25:23] MATT: How did you feel about Ms.

[00:25:24] FAWN: Wilkinson? I loved Mrs. Wilkinson so much. I loved her. I felt closer to her than my parents because she actually gave a, She cared about all of us. She cared about me. She was such a great teacher. She was lovely in all ways. I loved her, loved her, and I looked forward to going to school, and I was never a good student.

[00:25:54] FAWN: I loved going to school because of Mrs. Wilkinson. I loved the way she taught. I loved, I felt safe, I felt inspired. Um, I never liked to read. But I loved going into the beautiful reading nook that she created, and I loved touching all the books and reading the books. I loved her The Greatest Teacher. So anyways, so the principal comes in.

[00:26:23] FAWN: So the principal comes in, said, Mrs. Wilkinson, won't be here today. She got into an accident, so all the other kids loved her too. But what did we do in unison we stood up and cheered like, yay.

[00:26:39] FAWN: And um, and you, you know, we didn't think anything about it. All we were thinking was no school. Yay, no class. Yay. So, Mrs. Wilkinson found out,

[00:26:49] MATT: of course, because the principal's right

[00:26:50] FAWN: there. I mean, come on. Oh my goodness. We got a talking to when she came to. and I remember it went on and on and on. Much like how our kid was like, I get it, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

[00:27:04] FAWN: I'm like, No, I don't know if you do. Cuz I remembered Mrs. Wilkinson telling us her perspective, right? Of her finding out that we cheered, that she got into an accident, we cheered that she wasn't going to be there. And she explained to us . And she explain. How that is from her perspective.

[00:27:23] FAWN: Right. How awful it is that we cheered her mis misfortune and we supposedly love her and she cares for us. And like it just, she, she

[00:27:36] MATT: talks and you should cheer anybody's misfortune.

[00:27:40] FAWN: Shouldn't. Is that what you said? Yeah. Well you said

[00:27:43] MATT: you should. I was offering that up as bait for you to do that. Yes.

[00:27:49] FAWN: Anyway, but I remember to this day, I'm decades later, I think about this lesson. I wouldn't say every day, but every time I learned something, I recall how she made that point and made it very clear. Had I not heard her, had I not heard Mrs. Wilkinson yell at us like that and try to explain it to us. Because I, I tried to explain it to you and Allegra this morning, right?

[00:28:22] FAWN: Right. I said, if Mrs. Wilkinson came in and said, You know, that wasn't very nice. Do to others on, you know, whatever that is. Like, you have to treat people the way you wanna be treated. Please don't do that. It would, that message would not have gotten through. Decades later, it is still affecting me. That lesson that I learned from her being so upset with us and explaining, breaking it down what idiots we were right to not care for your fellow human being to cheer like that, not be concerned about their welfare, just be concerned about your own

[00:29:10] FAWN: stupid I don't get to work today. And you're not worried about her. She got into an accident we nobody asked. We were just like, Yay. No school to be so what's the word for it? Entitled To have that kind of disrespect, it just blows me away. And I see that on the playground. I see that with people with friendships, how they treat each.

[00:29:34] FAWN: At the risk of offending someone, You don't set anyone straight, and we need to, we need to have a Mrs. Wilkinson approach in like letting you know you're an idiot. What was that behavior about? You know what I'm saying? Still. Dang. I'm feeling accused over here, folks. I'm sorry. Just because I'm looking at you.

[00:29:54] FAWN: I'm not talking

[00:29:55] MATT: you right now. I know I'm feeling that way, but no, I've been in conversations with friends of mine and I've been like, You know, when they say something that is just inherently foolish, I call them on it. I do. And I'm like, You know that this is what you're really up to, right? And they're like, Dang.

[00:30:15] FAWN: Well, you know, even that, that seems very nice of you. Like. I'm glad they got it. I just feel like I have to say, What the hell?

[00:30:26] MATT: what? Whereas I have to say, Are you sure? Mm,

[00:30:30] FAWN: I know. See, I don't know. I don't know if it'll work. I

[00:30:33] MATT: know every time that's, that's how I roll, unfortunately. Well, fortunately or unfortunately, I need to get a little more edge, I

[00:30:38] FAWN: suppose.

[00:30:39] FAWN: Well, maybe it'll need to cuz you're a man and you're white and you're big. Well, the other

[00:30:43] MATT: thing that's key though is, and I'm little, this is only after. We've, we've, we've, we share,

[00:30:51] FAWN: we you're talking about you and your buddy.

[00:30:52] MATT: I go, me and my, some of my buddies. Yes. Danny, Tim, Jim. But yeah. You know, he'll, he'll yell at me when I deserve it and I'll yell at him when he deserves it.

[00:31:01] MATT: And we, we just expect that because, you know, there is never. Nobody lives an entire lifetime without pulling some stupid mistakes.

[00:31:12] FAWN: Right? Of course.

[00:31:14] MATT: So once you realize that, and it's a two-way street, then be honest. For goodness sake, don't be afraid.

[00:31:23] FAWN: I just, Yeah, Don't be afraid to look ugly. If you have someone in your life that sees like an instant of ugly, whatever ugly is to them, like, Oh God, for forbid you raise your voice and like you express your opinion.

[00:31:37] FAWN: If that's a deal breaker, well then good riddance BYE. That happened to me with the yoga bitches, you know, And then, and then they come and apologize. I'm like, No, because your behavior will not stop.

[00:31:47] FAWN: I could say, Okay, , you know, I could go, I could, I could think about it, but I know that this is kind of an abusive pattern that's never gonna break with these people, right? So I took, I took myself out of that situation. I took the girls out of that situation. We never spoke to them again.

[00:32:06] FAWN: Exactly. But it's different. I'm saying we all need to still be, unless it's an abusive relationship, that's not gonna stop. We need to be schooled.

[00:32:18] MATT: We need to hold each other accountable for their actions. And we need to, we need to, Yeah. Call it like you see it and don't be afraid. Right. That's

[00:32:25] FAWN: it. Okay.

[00:32:26] FAWN: That's it. I, I don't wanna talk too long.

[00:32:28] MATT: That I would, I took this conversation in a direction I was not, I was ill and prepared to take it

[00:32:33] FAWN: in. What do you mean? What direction was that? The active shooter? Yeah. Why did that make you cry? Is it because of what happened to you A few years ago? Matt almost died.

[00:32:43] MATT: ao,

[00:32:45] FAWN: and he always talks about how throughout all of it, he knew he was, he just told himself he was gonna be OK.

[00:32:51] FAWN: Even at the

[00:32:53] MATT: absolute worst. Yeah. And the absolute worst was had I known how bad the absolute worst was . But anyways, that's beside the point. Cuz I certainly knew I was pretty F'd, but I didn't understand.

[00:33:07] FAWN: But is that why you were crying,

[00:33:09] MATT: you think? Um, there's just, it's just, it's messed up when you start having empathy for people who have been shot.

[00:33:16] MATT: I. , you know, and, and you should have empathy for people who are shot, but then you put yourself in the same situation. You're like, Well,

[00:33:22] FAWN: and the thing is, in the American culture, little kids in preschools go through shooter drills. Right. Active shooter drills.

[00:33:31] MATT: I know. And I, I have no idea. I have no idea how they do it.

[00:33:35] MATT: This was a traumatic experience for me. You mean going through that, going, going through the actor shooter, drill, training, training. Not a drill. It was just training. It was just somebody talking.

[00:33:46] FAWN: Yeah. Preschoolers are taught to get on a toilet seat and lift their legs up. Right. Like the,

[00:33:54] MATT: it's unbelievable Here.

[00:33:58] MATT: I am not being afraid to say something, but this is unbelievable to

[00:34:01] FAWN: me. Yeah. Uh, welcome to our American society. There you go. Um, anyway, And how can the, how Nevermind I won't go there. Okay. So, That's it guys. , shoot it straight. Don't say shoot. Edit that out, . No, it's okay. Be honest. Be truthful. You know, don't be afraid to look ugly.

[00:34:25] FAWN: Your friends will love you regardless if they're true friends. We all know that. So don't be afraid to look ugly. Matt is waving goodbye. All right, we'll talk to you in a few days. Love you. Be well. Our friendly world Please go there. Tell other people to download our show. Leave us a review, a kind review, please , and uh, let's see what else, What else, what else?

[00:34:49] FAWN: Yeah, we wanna be friends. If you wanna hang out with us, email us. Okay. Love you. Bye.

[00:34:55] MATT: Be well.