Today, we discuss a key perspective needed to recover from the betrayal of a very, very bad friend. Beyond devastation, beyond the level of betrayal, we can and will find our way back to our perfect selves.
Have you ever had that person, that friend that was the worst? Like, you wish you had never, ever met this person? There may be people out there that are your enemy, that could do things to you that will disrupt and destroy what seems like everything including your sense of hope. Because of their actions and because of the situation that you were interlaced with, they could also be the spark and the motivation needed to get to the next level to get us to where our (the hero's) destiny lives, finding the motivation to go back to our true, powerful self.
Today, we discuss a key perspective needed to recover from the betrayal of a very, very bad friend. When the worst friend happens, it may feel like our entire life is shaken, even our physical body can shake like we're going through an ice storm. Have you ever gone through a breakup and it just, feels gross? You feel so exposed and downright shaky on all levels even physically I shake remembering some instances. It feels like all is lost and everything, quote unquote metaphorically speaking is burned down; everything is gone. Everything. We're stripped. Our life surroundings feel stripped. I think when this happens, it allows for a certain sparseness in order for us to find something that was buried, that was actually us; our sparkling us, that somehow got completely lost and buried. And because that “us” started to fade away, perhaps that's why the very, very, very, very bad friends came along.
So in a way, these people were actually our friends who decided to step in and act so ugly for us to be, for it to be the catalyst situation for us to get back to finding who we were at our greatest original form. It's like spiritual house cleaning. And when everything is gone, we're going to find our true self that was there all along, and that's why this very, very, very, very bad friend is our great friend. I'm not saying we're gonna hang out with them and go to tea with them and have pajama parties. I'm saying that it was a good thing. It was a good thing. They acted so ugly. They were selfless enough to come in and be such an ugly force, for us to get back on track.
Beyond devastation, beyond the level of betrayal, we can and will find our way back to perfect selves.
The Best Worst Friend
[00:00:00] FAWN: Hi everybody. Welcome back. Hi. Hello. This episode is for when you think that all is lost. That everything is destroyed.
[00:00:13] FAWN: Oh
[00:00:13] MATT: dear.
[00:00:13] FAWN: It's all bad and everything has burned to the ground.
[00:00:21] MATT: Wicked.
[00:00:22] FAWN: This episode is about the very worst friend, kind of like your best friend, but your worst friend.
[00:00:33] FAWN: That's our daughter singing in the background. They're making breakfast and running around, so you're gonna hear a lot of noise. . The very worst friend. How do I start this man? How did I explain it to you the other day? There's something I've been thinking about lately a lot more for some reason, and I know the reason actually.
[00:00:52] FAWN: Years and years ago in the photography industry, I, I had a group of friends and it's a small world and the photography community for me was not a very kind one. It was incredibly competitive and people were, people were not the kindest, I gotta tell you. So I left a lot of those friends behind, and I'm using the word friends, very friendly, , very friendly way.
[00:01:22] MATT: You left that peer group behind maybe is the right way to, it
[00:01:25] FAWN: wasn't even a peer group. They wouldn't even allow me in their group. I, it, it they were not my peers. Well, that's
[00:01:31] MATT: a whole other subject that I'd like to cover at
[00:01:33] FAWN: point. Yeah, definitely. But go ahead. What do you mean by that? Well, it's
[00:01:37] MATT: just
[00:01:41] MATT: don't wanna, seriously, I don't wanna get into it right now, but everybody likes to feel that they're above average inside of any peer group right. And, lacking objective measures, they go subjective. But then there's always those people who wanna maintain their above average status. And so you need people who they consider below average.
[00:02:01] MATT: It's a weird world, but that's social comparison theory in,
[00:02:05] FAWN: let's not talk about that right now. We'll talk about that next episode maybe, but, um, I don't know. Is it the same as when people, especially in Hollywood, when I was there, Hollywood, the, this thing was always said, cuz I, I was in the, in industry, in and out, you know, my head down trying to survive, trying to, like, trying to make it, you know mm-hmm.
[00:02:31] FAWN: before I mm-hmm. , forget it. I was like nuts to this, I'm out. Bye. And I, and I just did it on my. Far, far away from la. And so, um, is it the same as like constantly? What I heard was if you are, if you're nice, you're perceived as weak. That's what they would say. Right? And that's how they acted.
[00:03:00] FAWN: People were very mean. And a few years ago, I ran into a crowd from the industry that I had just met, but they were from Europe, and they were like, Fawn, it's totally changed. It's not like that anymore. That's like old school. I'm like, really? Because just, just, just the other night I was looking at some movies that were on Amazon.
[00:03:23] FAWN: And I saw one of my enemies,
[00:03:27] MATT: oh, see, I'm really glad I don't run into any of my enemies out there in the world,
[00:03:32] FAWN: but like, I'm like, okay, so now this person has a movie that they did, and it took me a while because I, I was like, okay, I, I don't wanna watch it because I want nothing to do with this person.
[00:03:46] FAWN: Just the, the name of this person triggers me. I'm like, well, I obviously have a charge, right? So I wanna get rid of that. So let, let me just be objective. What do you mean? Well,
[00:03:58] MATT: no, no, no, go ahead.
[00:03:59] FAWN: Why are you making
[00:03:59] FAWN: that noise?
[00:04:00] MATT: Just cause I generally, um, go through avoidance, but that's me.
[00:04:05] FAWN: Yeah, you avoid and then things happen and you get sick.
[00:04:08] FAWN: I, when things come up, I'm like, let me get this outta my spirit, outta my body. It doesn't belong with me. I gotta clear it.
[00:04:16] MATT: Right.
[00:04:16] FAWN: So I sat there and I was like, all right. I bet you I was thinking to myself, I bet you Fawn, that this movie will be all about her ,
[00:04:29] MATT: even though it's supposed to be a documentary on the state of the industry or some subject, right?
[00:04:33] MATT: No, it
[00:04:33] FAWN: was the state of the world. Oh, state of the whole world. Well, no, the culture, not even the world. They're not. Please like, so, so what's the word? Narcissistic and like self-absorbed please. You know, like so hard trying to be edgy. You know? They love that word, edgy. They, everyone would, you had to be edgy and I wasn't edgy.
[00:04:57] FAWN: You know, I was all about love and my pictures were just about the beauty of humanity. And so no, I didn't photograph edgy stuff. I could have, I was definitely in those situations. That's not where I choose to focus. Anyway, I'm getting off the subject, sorry. But I was like, I bet you it'll be about her. But anyway, so I, I turned, I, I started to play the movie and I didn't, I couldn't even watch the whole thing, but sure enough, the first 30 minutes all about her, it was like, oh my God, nothing has changed after all these years.
[00:05:33] FAWN: it's the same mess. It's the same freight
[00:05:35] FAWN: train.
[00:05:36] MATT: Well, it, it revolves around my theory that, you know, it really takes a catastrophic event to, to cause fundamental shifts in people. And that rarely happens because we get so much reinforcement in doing things the way we've always done things. And then you run into being Blockbuster video and you don't know what to do.
[00:05:53] FAWN: Well,
[00:05:53] FAWN: speaking of reinforcement, theyre reinforced because they're surrounded by a bunch of people, and that's how they act and that's the way to be and fine, that's their way. I want nothing to do with it. Right? Which is obviously why I'm here and they're there, , you know? And sometimes I just feel like, wow, I have totally veered off course because I'm not at this status level.
[00:06:17] FAWN: And I'm like, no, that's not the status level I ever wanted it. It's gross. It's gross how they, to me it's gross how they operate. So I want nothing to do with it. I'm just gonna do it my way. And unfortunately, my way is alone. Like this person totally did me dirt. Mm-hmm. , they did me dirt .
[00:06:39] MATT: Oh dear.
[00:06:39] FAWN: And I was trying to be kind and I was trying to be low key.
[00:06:42] FAWN: Mm-hmm. , but like I wasn't about to have them disrespect me, so I quietly walked away one day when they had me wait in their house for. Like close to three hours.
[00:06:54] MATT: Well, I'm sure they were really busy with things other than just talking to random people on the phone.
[00:06:58] FAWN: They were talking to like quote unquote famous, influential people
[00:07:03] MATT: and Right, right, right.
[00:07:04] MATT: Definition more important than you, and I wanna make
[00:07:06] MATT: sure you know that.
[00:07:07] FAWN: Yeah, exactly. And I was there. I don't remember. It was a friend had set up a meeting for us, for us to become like acquaintances. Mm-hmm. in the industry and perhaps, I don't know, this other friend thought maybe I could assist her on something.
[00:07:23] FAWN: I don't know. It was just a meet, like a meeting and three hours. I was sitting there totally ignored by her. And she like goes about her day and she's like, She barely said two words to me, so close to hour three. I was like, I'm outta here. Right? So I quietly, like I just said, okay, bye, thank you. Right? And I left.
[00:07:44] FAWN: And then I thought, you know, she would get it like, wow,
[00:07:48] MATT: I totally dissed this person. And who totally was waiting for me for, oh my goodness, it's been three hours. I didn't realize.
[00:07:55] FAWN: So I, when I got back to my studio mm-hmm. , I get a call. The friend who set this up and she's like, what did you do? She said, you were a psycho.
[00:08:06] FAWN: She called me a psycho. I'm like, wow. Wow. So anyway, is it
[00:08:12] MATT: because you didn't get upset because you probably sat there reasonably bored, waiting sometimes for
[00:08:18] FAWN: the meeting? We've talked about this, Matt. Sometimes when you do someone wrong when someone does something wrong. Right. They'll make any excuse to justify their behavior.
[00:08:28] FAWN: Yes. So yeah, I'm, I was "crazy", I was whatever, "psycho", whatever. Just because I decided to quietly say, well, thank you. I'm gonna leave. It's been three hours now. I'm gonna leave now. Bye bye. Like, I'm sorry you're this famous person. I don't care. Right. You know what I mean? My time is my life. My life is valuable also.
[00:08:49] FAWN: Anyway, I didn't say any of that. I just quietly bowed out, you know? Mm-hmm. . Anyway, so a few months later I was applying to this grant, and I was turned down in such a way, I don't remember the words, Matt, but it was so ugly. I'm like, wow, why aren't they just turning me down? Why are they attacking my character?
[00:09:12] FAWN: Guess who was on the committee to let people in? She was. Anyway. Anyway, this is just me still venting about the other night. Sorry, but, what I'm trying to say is that there are people out there that are your enemy. That will do things to you that will disrupt everything. That will destroy everything.
[00:09:36] FAWN: Not only things that you've built in your life, but they destroy your sense of hope. Because of their actions and because of the situation that you were interlaced with, they are the spark that feels like destroys everything. Mm-hmm. destroys your spirit destroys your, whatever you were working on physically.
[00:09:56] FAWN: Have you ever had that person, that friend that was the worst? Like, you're like, oh my goodness, like you wish you had never, ever met this person.
[00:10:10] MATT: Okay. Not that far, but close.
[00:10:12] FAWN: So the thing that I've learned that I, that I wanna talk about today briefly, and, and that's it. I'm so sorry to talk about the photography thing for so long.
[00:10:22] FAWN: But like, for example, for me, those best friends were the yoga bitches that I always talk about. They, except for our kids, they really hurt our kids. There because they're way younger. It, it, it took them, they're still trying to recover from it, right? From their betrayal, the betrayal of the very, very bad friend, and there were multiple of them.
[00:10:50] FAWN: It was a group. When that happens, your entire life, is shaken, even your physical body. Have you ever gone through a breakup and it's just, it feels gross? You feel so exposed and downright shaky on all levels, like even physically I shake. Does that happen
[00:11:11] FAWN: to you, Matt?
[00:11:12] MATT: Okay. For me it's a little different.
[00:11:14] MATT: Um, when I, when I were lad I played soccer and once or twice I got involved, I think it was only once. Thank goodness where I got the air knocked outta. Soccer ball hit me in the stomach, or who knows what, right? Mm-hmm. , when you get the air knocked outta you, you can't breathe. You're breathing, but it feels like you can't breathe.
[00:11:32] MATT: It feels like you're never gonna catch your breath. You're lying down on the ground. You're surrounded by people who are looking at you like, oh my goodness, what's happening? And, and you eventually catch your breath and life goes on, right? Mm-hmm. . That's how I feel.
[00:11:46] FAWN: Wow.
[00:11:47] MATT: I feel like I can't breathe, and I think it's because I got the air knocked outta me when
[00:11:51] MATT: I were lad.
[00:11:53] MATT: Wow. It's, it's really a frightening thing. Yeah. And yet, you know, as long as you're breathing, you're okay, but it just feels like you just can't catch. And it's like, that's, that's ridiculous. If you've never had it happen to you, it doesn't make any sense.
[00:12:07] FAWN: So you've had that also happen on a spiritual sense.
[00:12:10] MATT: That's how it feels when Yeah, something like that happens. It feels like I just can't catch my breath.
[00:12:16] FAWN: I'm sorry, honey
[00:12:18] MATT: is what it is .
[00:12:20] FAWN: Well, when this happens, this is what I've learned. When all is lost mm-hmm. , I feel like because all is lost and everything, quote unquote metaphorically speaking is burned down, everything is gone.
[00:12:36] FAWN: Mm-hmm. , everything. Your stripped. Your life surroundings feel stripped. I think when that happens, it allows for a certain sparseness, for you to find something that was buried, that was actually you; you're sparkling you, right? That somehow got completely lost and buried right? And because that started to fade away, perhaps that's why, one tends to attract these other very, very, very, very bad friends.
[00:13:13] FAWN: So in a way, speaking, like if you're gonna step away from where you are and step further away and further away, and just look at the planet from outer space and everything is really small, and then you look at it like maybe on an angelic realm, these people were actually your best friends who decided to step in and say, you know what, I'm gonna come in and act so ugly
[00:13:38] FAWN: for you to be; for it to be like the catalyst situation for you to get back to finding who you were. Right.
[00:13:46] MATT: Well, it's who you are. It's, it's like spiritual house cleaning.
[00:13:49] FAWN: Exactly. Oh my God. Yeah. That's totally it. So you know when everything is gone, you're going to find your true self that was there all along, and that's why this very, very, very, very bad friend
[00:14:07] FAWN: is your best friend. I'm not saying you're gonna hang out with them and go to tea with them and have pajama parties. I'm saying that it was a good thing. It was a good thing. They acted so ugly. They were selfless enough to come in and be such an ugly force, for you to get back on track. So for me, like with the yoga crew mm-hmm.
[00:14:31] FAWN: when all that happened, oh my God, it, it was devastation. I couldn't believe the level of betrayal, right? And the level of stupidity, who that was happening, ignorance, all of that. And then little by little throughout the quiet, I discovered little things like my aviator glasses. My aviator sunglasses, little sparks of who I was way back from the Santa Monica days.
[00:15:01] FAWN: Mm-hmm. . And it started to come back. Right. And I'm like, and I thought it was just an inner thing. And then what also came back was that sense of power that I had inside of me, that like supremely powerful Fawn. That supremely powerful you getting back to remembering who that was; the" vibrant, nothing can get you down,
[00:15:26] FAWN: you're gonna make it, you're an amazing force." That, that for me was lost before I met these people. Mm-hmm. . And I feel like I met them for me to get angry enough in a way to find myself again. And I thought it was just me and I thought it was just on the inside, but it took a friend who knows my Santa Monica days.
[00:15:49] FAWN: She came to visit us and she looked at me as we were walking to the car one day. She's like, oh my God, Santa Monica is back. I'm like, oh, she's looking at my aviators, , or like, just the way I was strutting, you know, just my walk. My walk was different. Mm-hmm. , my walk was back. My, my power was back. The martial artsy, like inner vibe, circle was back.
[00:16:19] FAWN: I gotta thank the very, very bad friend.
[00:16:23] FAWN: Multiple.
[00:16:24] MATT: I totally get it. I wouldn't
[00:16:26] MATT: quantify them as a friend. I'd more like say that they were a teacher here to give you a lesson, as it were. And I know there was a long relationship before that, but the end of the friendship was the lesson. . Yeah. And I had something very similar.
[00:16:40] MATT: And this was, this was, this was high school. I was, you know, I was 15. Um, I literally, this was my best friend. We had been best friends for a long time. We had a, we had a Kool-Aid stand together. My goodness. He lived in the same housing track, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Um, I used to, yeah.
[00:17:01] MATT: underage. I used to, I used to be one of those annoying people who would hang real estate signs on people's doors. You did? Yes. You know, the little flyers to say, Hey, do such and such. I gotta, you know, I got paid better than minimum wage. But, and really, but he and I worked at that. It was, it was his gig and he cut me in on it and everything.
[00:17:21] MATT: And when that friendship burned to the ground, I burned it to the ground, first of all, cuz I got fed up with stuff. Mm-hmm. . So it was a matter of taking back, you know, my own sense of self as you described. You know, I lost all of that, but I didn't feel like a loss because it was just like I got rid of things that weren't serving me.
[00:17:43] MATT: Mm-hmm. , which is wholly different. And then later I had a later experience where something similar happened. In that instance it was actually a different focus. I didn't feel like I burned everything down, it felt like all of a sudden I had a lot of free time and I started saying, okay, I'm gonna focus on the things I excel at and I'm gonna pick up stuff that I don't know how to do that I've always wanted to.
[00:18:06] MATT: And that's when I, stuff like learned how to hit a ball with a bat cuz I didn't know how to do that , which is really funny, but I didn't, and I, that was always something I wanted to be reasonably competent at. And I got reasonably competent. Now, I haven't done it forever, but that's another
[00:18:23] MATT: story.
[00:18:23] FAWN: But that's your, one of your go-tos is going to the batting
[00:18:26] MATT: cages.
[00:18:26] MATT: That's just it. There's a certain piece to that as far as what works for me. Yeah, and that's also when I picked up disc golf and that's also blah, blah, blah, blah. A lot of the things that I do that I enjoy, stem from, losing sight of this teacher.
[00:18:42] FAWN: It goes back to, once again, the world is a small town
[00:18:45] FAWN: and everybody's your friend, right? And you know, the girls used to like saying, that's not our friend. I'm like, but it is. And you just said they're not. You wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't call them your friend, but they are your friends. Because if you look at it on a level of like an Akashic level, you know, a level of, um, spirit that before you're a person, before you're here as a human being, walking planet earth. We've talked about this, like for years on our podcast, I always say even the person that you walk past on a city sidewalk, that that's a meeting that was planned. Everything is planned. Everything is a meeting perfectly timed. And I think that these ugly, horrible, horrible people,
[00:19:39] FAWN: there's a contract and yeah, it's on a soul level, this person chose to be the hated character, the villain of a movie, and in a way that's pretty noble.
[00:19:55] MATT: Right. Well, the villain in a movie, I think via John Campbell's kind of thought about the whole thing, forces our hero to really embrace their destiny and really, bring everything to full focus.
[00:20:09] MATT: You know, uh, typically in a martial arts movie, it's when they start training, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Mm-hmm. and getting really good, really, you know, able to quote unquote, defeat
[00:20:19] MATT: this enemy.
[00:20:19] FAWN: That's when you want to bowl.
[00:20:23] MATT: Oh my goodness.
[00:20:23] FAWN: Do you remember that movie with Jean Claude Van Damme Kickboxer? Oh, have you ever watched that movie, "Kickboxer"
[00:20:29] FAWN: maybe they changed it. They
[00:20:31] MATT: probably have, God knows I have mocked it often enough. But the, the antagonist name was Tong Po. And our hero, Jean-Claude Van Dam is like, I want to, the line is I want Tong Po because he wants to battle him.
[00:20:45] FAWN: He wants to fight. Fight. He killed his brother or something, right?
[00:20:48] FAWN: I don't remember.
[00:20:48] MATT: He mamed
[00:20:49] MATT: his brother. Yeah.
[00:20:49] MATT: Like paralyzed. But anyway, right. That's right. . But yeah, on the DVD DVDs. Remember those? Um, the, what? The translations I was, I was running the subtitles and the subtitle came across. I want to bowl . Like to go bowling? To go bowling. Oh dear.
[00:21:06] FAWN: Oh dear. But that's the, I wanna go bowling moment.
[00:21:09] FAWN: Right, right. When you get to that level,
[00:21:12] MATT: when you finally realized he finally got all the motivation he needed to get to the next level to get to where the hero's
[00:21:18] FAWN: destiny. Yeah, and that's basically it. Finding the motivation to go back to your true, powerful self. And that's it. That's the very, very, very, very bad friend.
[00:21:30] FAWN: Thank you. And as, I don't know
[00:21:34] MATT: if I want to thank him, but it certainly was a growing moment. Yeah.
[00:21:37] FAWN: You, you have to be thankful for it. You get to a point where you're like, thank you, thank you, cuz I never have to see you again. Hopefully, or, and also thank you because I'm in a better place now. I'm, I'm free and clear of all the debris, all the garbage.
[00:21:55] FAWN: Thank
[00:21:55] MATT: you. I would say thank you for the lesson. I wouldn't say thank you to the person, .
[00:22:00] FAWN: Okay. You have to work on it, Matt. No way, man. You're still holding onto some stuff. . All right, friends, that's it. We'll talk to you in just a few days. We love you so much. Thank you for listening. We'll talk to you in a few days again.
[00:22:14] FAWN: Bye. Be well. Bye.
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